Andrew Clennell: Big day on Sunday Agenda. Joining me live is Trade Minister, Don Farrell from Adelaide. Don Farrell, thanks for your time. Let me start with this deal to put Chris Bowen in the COP Vice-Presidency, why is this a good idea for Australia?
Minister for Trade and Tourism, Don Farrell: Well, firstly, Chris is a perfect candidate for that job; he looks after these issues in Australia, and now Australia, with Chris, has the opportunity to do that on the national stage. We were disappointed that we weren't able to get the COP conference here in Adelaide, in fact it would have been held in the building that's just behind me at the moment at the Adelaide Convention Centre.
So that was disappointing. But I think having Chris at the helm of the international consideration of how we get to net zero is a good thing for Australia. It means we are right at the heart of all of these discussions; we're being involved in those discussions. You've just heard on your show how the Prime Minister is committed to net zero by 2050, so I think in the circumstances, it was the best outcome that was possible to achieve.
Andrew Clennell: I'm just not sure politically it's ideal though. You've got energy prices surging, and Chris Bowen doing a job which will be seen as contributing to rising energy prices or can be put that way. He'll be seen as having divided loyalties now; one loyalty to a UN body and one to Australia, won't he?
Minister Farrell: Look, I am unequivocal in the view that Chris Bowen's loyalty is to Australia and the people of Australia. So everything that he would do on the national stage would be to contribute to Australia's contribution to net zero.
I'm absolutely certain Chris won't be doing anything other than things that are in Australia's national interests. But remember this, the world by and large is committed the net zero project; Australia's committed to that, the G20 countries just re‑committed to that over the weekend. I think Australia's involvement in that, both domestically ‑ and just have a think about this, Andrew, more than 100,000 people have picked up Chris Bowen's plan to install an electric battery in their homes. This has been a terrific project, it was an announcement that we made before the last election, Chris has had the job of implementing that, and it's been a huge success.
Andrew Clennell: Are you disappointed for your home State of South Australia that Anthony Albanese ceded to the Turks on this one?
Minister Farrell: Look, politics is the art of the possible, as you know, Andrew. I was with the Premier last night, he of course was disappointed, but he understands that these things don't always go the way that you want them to go, and I think in the circumstances that we were confronted with in Brazil, this was the best possible outcome we could get for Australia.
Andrew Clennell: He didn't sound off at you, Don Farrell, because he didn't sound so happy about it in his public comments during the week.
Minister Farrell: No, he didn't sound ‑ in fact he said some rather nice things about me to a conference of my old union last night. So, no, he didn't sound off at me at all.
Look, the one thing you can say about Peter Malinauskas, apart from being a fantastic Premier, of course, is he understands politics. Of course he was disappointed, because South Australia had, you know, wanted to host the event, would have done a terrific job. We've got a terrific story to tell in terms of renewable energy in this State; we lead the country in terms of conversion to renewables, but Premier Malinauskas, he's a very practical man and understands what's happened here.
There are plenty of other opportunities into the future, I think, to host events in South Australia, and I'm sure the Premier will be looking at some of those.
Andrew Clennell: Well, I actually had Mr Malinauskas on Politics Now last Tuesday, and he wasn't too happy about the situation with NDIS health funding at the moment. Did he mention that to you?
Minister Farrell: No, no, he didn't. We don't discuss every single issue, Andrew, when we meet, we try and have a ‑‑
Andrew Clennell: Are you confident that ‑‑
Minister Farrell: ‑‑ working relationship.
Andrew Clennell: ‑‑ that can be resolved? Is the Federal Government going to have to throw some more money at the States here?
Minister Farrell: Well, look, I was with the Health Minister, Mark Butler, yesterday morning at an event. We launched the campaign of Aria Bolkus down in the Seat of Colton for the next State election.
We've got a very competent Federal Health Minister; we have a very competent Premier in South Australia. I'm sure all of these issues are capable of being resolved, with some good will. You know, times are tough in the sense of, you know, making sure you've got enough money to fund all of the projects that you'd like to fund, but I'm sure that the goodwill between the Premier, and the other Premiers for that matter, and Minister Butler, are such that we can work through all of these problems.
Andrew Clennell: Sounds like you're in a position to negotiate between the two or assist that, Don Farrell. Now, look, is it time, as I've reported, for the energy rebates to come off?
Minister Farrell: Look, that's something that the Government will have to consider. Obviously, they've been instrumental in pushing people's power bills down, and keeping inflation lower than it otherwise would have been. So, they've been doing their jobs, those rebates, but it will be an issue that the Government will have to consider in the days and the weeks ahead.
Andrew Clennell: And will a gas reservation work when it comes to bringing down power prices, do you think?
Minister Farrell: Again, gas reservations was an issue discussed in the last election. You might recall that the Opposition made an announcement that they were going to implement a gas reservation policy if they had won the election. It's an issue that's been under consideration. I know our Resources Minister, Madeleine King, and Tim Ayres, are looking at these issues and we'll give it good consideration and come up with, as we always do, a very sensible policy in this space.
Andrew Clennell: Moving on to your portfolio of trade, Don Farrell, Donald Trump lifted tariffs recently on beef and other food products presumably because of cost of living, political concerns in the US. Do you have any reaction to that? I assume you don't claim credit for it?
Minister Farrell: Look, what we do claim credit for is persisting with our argument with the United States that tariffs on Australian products are an act of economic self‑harm. Right from day one, at my first discussions with Howard Lutnick, the American Commerce Secretary, and Jamieson Greer, the United States Trade Representative, we argued that the tariffs were the wrong policy. It was heading in the wrong direction.
Firstly, it was in breach of our Free Trade Agreement with the United States, and secondly it was simply going to push up prices for American consumers, whether it was in hamburgers or steaks at a restaurant, and of course that's exactly what's happened here, Andrew.
And so our persistent and consistent argument to the Americans, they have finally understood what we were saying, and have acted accordingly. Now, we're not going to stop there, Andrew. There are still tariffs on other Australian products, and my job as Trade Minister is to convince the Americans that they are heading down the wrong path with these tariffs.
When you apply a tariff to a country, that means you're sending them a message that you want to buy less of their goods. This week we had some very successful discussions, both with the Europeans, and our fellow members of the CPTPP, and all of our ASEAN partners, about how we can do more work together to reduce tariffs and to increase trade. If you're an outward‑facing Australian company, then your profits are likely to be higher, if you can export; more importantly, the wages of your staff are likely to be higher. So, while America might be heading in one direction, almost the rest of the world is heading in another direction, and we are very hopeful that in the near future we can have some very positive announcements about new Free Trade Agreements.
Andrew Clennell: All right. But you're not announcing the EU Free Trade Agreement on Sunday Agenda. Is that ever going to ‑‑
Minister Farrell: Not today.
Andrew Clennell: Not today.
Minister Farrell: Not today, Andrew.
Andrew Clennell: Not today. That's a promise. All right. So ‑ almost a promise. But I understand the Prime Minister actually discussed this with the European leaders at the G20. So do you feel closer to it?
Minister Farrell: Look, we had an excellent meeting with my counterpart, Maroš Šefčovič. He's the new Trade Minister. I had my first meeting with him just after he took office earlier this year. I said in front of him to the group of CPTPP members in Melbourne on Thursday, I quoted that memorable quote of Margaret Thatcher, when she first met Mr Gorbachev, she said that "this is a man we can do business with," and she reported that to President Reagan.
I think Maroš Šefčovič is a man that we can do business with, and I'm looking forward to finalising a Free Trade Agreement with him.
Andrew Clennell: Did you tell him to tear down this wall as well?
Minister Farrell: No, no, I didn't. Well, that's already happened. That's already happened, and Mr Šefčovič was on the other side of the wall back in 1988 when that occurred.
Andrew Clennell: All right. The CPTPP, I must admit, I've been dying to utter that term, that acronym ‑ gosh, it's something, isn't it ‑ do you think we'll ever see either China or Taiwan in that agreement? I suspect not.
Minister Farrell: Well, look, that's for the members of the group to decide. Every new accession to that organisation requires a consensus decision, so every country has to agree to the accession of any new applicant.
We have been dealing with Costa Rica, and we're very confident that by the end of the year Costa Rica will have fulfilled all of its obligations to join the CPTPP, and that we will have our 13th member.
On that point, we have settled on the next four countries for accession, that starts with Uruguay and then we'll move to the Philippines, Indonesia, and the United Arab Emirates.
So we have demonstrated that, firstly, we are capable of doing free and fair trade agreements with a greater range of countries. The fact that so many countries are interested in joining our group I think is a very positive sign. We wanted to send the message to the rest of the world that Australia and our fellow members are open for business. We want to do more trade, and we want to do more free and fair trade. And so, I'm confident ‑‑
Andrew Clennell: Including with China and Taiwan, that was the actual original question.
Minister Farrell: Well, look, we are dealing with all of those countries. There's a long ‑ Andrew, there's a long list of countries that would like to join the CPTPP. We've worked out a program. Countries have to be able to demonstrate that they believe in free and fair trade before they can be admitted, and we are working through, slowly, I admit, but carefully, 'cause we want to make the right decisions ‑‑
Andrew Clennell: All right.
Minister Farrell: ‑‑ and we're ensuring that we're bringing all of the members of that group with us.
Andrew Clennell: Being put to me yesterday if you want to get the environmental laws through the Senate this week, you might have to do a deal with the Greens rather than the Coalition. Is that fair? Could that happen?
Minister Farrell: Well, we have a very, very good Environment Minister in Murray Watt. He's a very skilled negotiator. He knows exactly what he wants to do to ensure that we do more to save the environment, but do more to ensure that business continues in this country. He's a skilled negotiator, I'm sure in the days ahead, cause we've only got one week left, that he will do his level best to get a consensus on this.
I don't think it has to be one or the other, I know that's the way it's being played out. I'm sure he'll be working with both the Coalition and the Greens, and the rest of the crossbench, to ensure that this important piece of legislation passes before the end of the year.
Andrew Clennell: Just finally, there are suggestions now the Opposition will come up with a policy, I believe it's not this week, but it will be in coming weeks, to substantially reduce immigration. What's your reaction to that?
Minister Farrell: Look, I'd be disappointed if they headed in that direction, to be honest, Andrew. Immigration is important for the future of this country. It should be a bipartisan issue. For the most of the history of this country, immigration has been a bipartisan issue. I'd much prefer it to be the Government and the Opposition sitting down, working out what is the best way to go forward in the immigration space.
Andrew Clennell: Trade Minister, Don Farrell. Thanks so much for your time.
Minister Farrell: Great to talk with you.